At PAX West, I had the chance to sit down with David Brevik, one of the legendary figures behind Diablo and now co-founder of Skystone Games. While Brevik is often associated with iconic ARPGs, our conversation ranged far beyond the past, delving into the challenges of modern publishing, the role of AI in development, consulting work with titles like Torchlight Infinite, his thoughts on the ever-shifting industry, and his lingering feelings about Diablo — the series that made him a household name in gaming.
Founding Skystone Games
Brevik’s latest chapter in the games industry began in 2020 with the creation of Skystone Games, just as the world was shutting down due to COVID-19. His long storied history has shifted from actively developing first party titles to publishing and assisting new developers intent on breaking into the scene. While he still fiddles around with his own development as part of Graybeard Games, stepping into publishing in an attempt to bring a host of new fun games to market:
MMORPG: You’ve been working with Skystone since 2020. How did the company get started, and what’s your philosophy as an indie publisher?
David: “Skystone, which is a company that myself and Bill Wang, my friend of mine for many years, I’ve known for about 20 years now, we started a company in 2020, right as COVID was starting… We started out and built this publisher, an indie publisher, published several games… Our philosophy at first was, let’s just try and find fun games and good, solid developers… As we’ve grown and kind of honed in on what it is that we’re looking for, it’s kind of games that I really vibe with, deep mechanic games, lots of depth and strategy, replayability, roguelike elements, RPGs. Those are always things I really enjoyed.”
Skystone in many ways reflects Brevik’s personal design philosophy, emphasizing depth, replayability, and meaningful mechanics. Rather than chasing trends, like battle royale or yet another survivalcraft title, the company curates games that seem to align with Brevik’s tastes. So far this approach has set Skystone apart from many other publishers with many of their published titles having found overwhelmingly positive receptions and awards.
A Different Kind of Indie Publisher
Yet, Brevik isn’t simply fronting funds to bring games through to completion. He noted that Skystone is not just a business venture, it’s a platform for mentorship, and he’s still coding everyday. Brevik’s assistance feels like an end-to-end support system for developers looking to bring their vision to fruition.
MMORPG: How much input do you have with the developers you publish?
David: “As much as they want, really. I’m not making the game — it’s their game, and I don’t want to take over. But I’m here to help, right? I’m here as a resource, which makes us kind of a different indie publisher than most. Somebody that has a long history in development, I’m still doing development. I still program every day. I can help them with technical advice, feedback on design, playtesting, connecting them with animators or other people I know. That’s really what makes us very different.”
With decades of design and leadership experience, this hands-on approach underscores what Skystone brings to the table. With so much uncertainty in modern publishing, especially where the bigger studios are concerned, Brevik was adamanet that Skystone could be the difference between a game finding its niche or fading into obscurity.
Consulting and Torchlight Infinite
In addition to publishing, Brevik has remained active as a consultant. His work on Torchlight Infinite provided a window into how his design expertise translates to new markets and platforms.
MMORPG: You’ve been consulting for years, including on Torchlight Infinite. What happened with that project, and what’s your approach when consulting with developers?
David: “They came to me and asked if I was interested. I love the Torchlight series! It was really just playing, giving feedback, advice on directions. They can take my advice or leave it, but I gave feedback on things like that. Some of the things I suggested, they changed. It was a great experience.”
MMORPG: Was there any advice you gave that made it into the final game?
David: “Yeah, I can’t recall right now, off the top of my head, some of the things, but for sure, there were things that changed.”
Brevik spoke at length that his consulting role wasn’t just advisory in name as some may have expected. It was hands-on. At the time, it certainly felt like a marketing boost to XD Games that was still attempting to find its footing with their new mobile title. Though even without specific examples at hand, the Torchlight Infinite team seemed to make full use of Brevik’s presence. XD Games has certainly changed the scope of the game a lot since last Brevik was involved, but T:I is still kicking with new seasons and updates.
The State of the Industry
The topic shifted to the industry’s turbulence in recent years that has led to layoffs, studio closures, and widespread uncertainty. Brevik sees this not as an anomaly but as part of a broader cycle shaped by technological shifts and economic realities. It almost feels like a “correction” in a post-covid world where development was spurred by studios expanding and technological breakthroughs that make development easier than it has ever been. Now, years later, there’s a contraction of larger studios, with the reasoning being multi-faceted.
MMORPG: The industry feels like it’s in a precarious place right now. What’s your outlook, where do you think it’s headed in the next 10 years?
David: “Wow, that’s a great question. I think there will be a rebound at some point, but something like this was almost inevitable. Two big things got us here: first, digital distribution removed the barriers of manufacturing and retail deals. Suddenly anyone could publish on Steam for $100. Second, engines like Unity and Unreal made it so almost anyone can make a game — you don’t even need to be a programmer anymore. That’s why we see thousands of games released a year. There’s so much competition now, it’s overwhelming. So in a lot of ways, I think this is the new normal. But I do think there will be a rebound. Big companies overspent during COVID and contracted, but they’ll form new teams and projects again to ensure future revenue.”
With a saturation of so many genres it’s clear that there’s an overwhelming number of options when it comes to finding games to play. How do great games stand out in a sea of annual releases?
AI and the Creative Process
Artificial intelligence has become a divisive force in the industry. For Brevik, the technology is both inevitable and troubling.
MMORPG: With AI tools becoming more common, such as art generation, coding assistance, even voiceover, what’s your take on how this will impact future development?
David: “I think it’s inevitable, but I’m also kind of saddened by it. I dislike the fact that it uses stuff that people have created to learn from and create new things… and the people that created it originally don’t get any kind of credit. But I don’t see how we’re going to stop it. Someday maybe we’ll have something like typing a prompt into ChatGPT and out comes a game, but for now, it’s just bits and pieces. And inevitably, those bits and pieces will be part of the future.”
MMORPG: Have you seen indie developers already relying on AI in their pitches?
David: “Yeah, sometimes we get pitch documents or prototypes with AI art. Most of the time they specify, saying they couldn’t afford an artist. I kind of give them some slack there. But inevitably, AI will be part of the future. I think there will always be stigma, but unfortunately, the artist usually loses in that case.”
Brevik’s unease echoes the concerns of many creatives. With a SAG-AFTRA deal specifying AI protections, it’s clear that there is a huge pushback of professionals attempting to slow the spread of AI. While AI lowers entry barriers, it also raises ethical questions about compensation and ownership. Still, Brevik views its integration into the industry as unavoidable, and as someone who has seen AI game generation begin to show signs of life at conventions like PAX East and struggling indie titles, it’s only a matter of time before this becomes more common place.
Mobile and Monetization
Another area where Brevik has strong opinions is monetization. With game budgets ballooning, he sees free-to-play and live-service models not as exploitative by default, but as necessary for survival.
MMORPG: With games so expensive, monetization keeps shifting — battle passes, ads, free-to-play models. What’s your take?
David: “Games haven’t increased much in price in 40 years. Nobody is willing to pay $200 for a game. So either we raise prices to $250 for a AAA game, or we find other models. That’s why free-to-play and battle passes exist. Complaining about it isn’t going to change it — this is the model. A few people pay a lot so the rest can play for free, and it works. It’s incredibly risky to make games, so there has to be alternatives to generate revenue.”
Brevik frames monetization debates as economic realities. If consumers resist higher base prices (despite some games still finding success at higher base costs), then alternative models become inevitable. We also talked about ad-revenue, but Brevik pointed out that ad-supported games only really make money when they are popular. These days, mobile games that are ad-supported are a dime a dozen, so it’s very hard to be profitable long term without a breakout hit with ad revenue. Skystone Games, however, is already exploring mobile ventures publishing US versoin of popular titles like Watcher of Realms and upcoming indie projects optimized for handheld play.
Web3, NFTs, and Industry Fads
MMORPG: What about the rise and fall of Web3 and NFTs? What was your experience when that fad started?
David: “I don’t see almost any Web3 things anymore. People were pitching me constantly… that’s all gone. I never officially consulted on any of it. To this day, I feel like nobody can really explain to me what an NFT is — and I’m a technical expert. If I can’t understand it, I don’t know how anybody else can.”
For Brevik, the collapse of Web3 hype isn’t surprising. While we still have some holdouts for well established titles, or publishers that have seen success with Web3 games, it’s clear it didn’t pan out as the future of gaming, and Brevik has no interest in working in that space.
Revisiting Diablo and Old Wounds
No conversation with David Brevik would be complete without touching on Diablo, the franchise he helped create. While Skystone and consulting work keep him busy, Brevik still carries complicated feelings about leaving the series behind.
MMORPG: Looking back, when you were designing the first Diablo, did you imagine it would grow into the juggernaut it is today?
David: “When we were first designing the game and trying to find a publisher, we got rejected at least 20 times. Everyone told us RPGs were dead. Finally Blizzard — then Silicon & Synapse — said yes. Our dream was maybe selling 20,000 copies. If we could do that, maybe we could make a sequel. It went way beyond what we ever expected.”
MMORPG: Do you have any regrets about leaving Diablo behind?
David: “There are a few things that make me sad. Diablo is definitely my baby, and leaving that behind was extremely difficult. But I don’t really have regrets. The problems we had were with ownership and upper management — they were a mess. So while it was sad, I’m super happy with where my career has gone and with life in general.”
For Brevik, Diablo will always be personal. It’s the project that defined his career, but also the one that forced him to make painful choices that, in retrospect, is bittersweet. .
MMORPG: Have they ever asked you to return to the franchise?
David: “They talked a few times, but it was never the right time. At one point, we thought maybe there might be a window, but it didn’t work out. Now I don’t know anybody there anymore. It’s so different now — there were 100 of us then, now there are thousands. The politics are totally different.”
Even if the door opened, Brevik is clear-eyed about the reality, returning to Diablo would mean entering an industry machine that no longer resembles the small, passionate team where it all began. But with that said, I don’t think there are any developers working on Diablo that wouldn’t want the game’s creator to return in some capacity. Brevik has stated that there are still stories there he would have liked to tell. Maybe one day we may have the chance to hear them.
Advice for Indie Developers
No PAX West interview would be complete without speaking to the prevalence and importance of the Indie gaming scene. For smaller studios, Brevik has no shortage of practical advice.
MMORPG: What advice would you give small studios looking for a publisher?
David: “It’s a tough industry right now. You’re going to get rejected a lot, but don’t let that discourage you. Somebody will probably say yes. Find the right publisher, one you trust, who prioritizes your product. Believe in what you’re doing. Do your best. Don’t give up.
You can point to one person a year out of 20,000 who makes a breakout hit on their own. Unless you catch lightning in a bottle, you need a publisher. Publishers give advice, feedback, set you up with practices like when to release a demo or join Steam Next Fest. People say, ‘But publishers take half the money.’ Well, if they can help you sell twice as many copies — or more — then it’s worth it.”
It’s a perspective that cuts through the romanticism of indie success stories. While solo developers occasionally achieve breakout hits, Brevik emphasizes that they are exceptions. For most, the support and infrastructure of a publisher remains essential.
Looking Ahead
MMORPG: Where do you see Skystone Games in five years?
David: “Our goal is to slowly grow over time and publish a whole bunch of different types of games — from free-to-play and mobile to cross-platform titles. Hopefully cross-play. And maybe someday we’ll do internal development.”
Brevik’s journey from shaping Diablo to mentoring indies has been anything but linear. Yet, his passion for the industry is still prevalent after all this time. We thank David for his time and hope to catch up again soon.
